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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 11:39:51 AM | Problems replacing walls....................

#1

Hogmodo


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RAC 2008

The client has thrown us a curve in "value engineering" after a high bid.  He wants to switch our exterior walls from stud bearing walls to ICF which is, in this case, a 9" wide block with 2-1/2" polystyrene walls and an empty 4" core which is filled with rebar and concrete.  They stack these up like CMU, brace ithe wall and pour a solid concrete core wall.

So, my exterior walls are changing thickness by almost double.  I have both walls aligned to the exterior face of the core, swap all of the old walls for the new wall, but the new wall goes in matching the finish face!  This throws out all dimensions, also omits all windows and most, not all, of the doors.  This is now a royal pain in the keester to shift walls, re-insert windows, put back in dimension lines, etc.

If both walls are aligned to the same exterior face of core and that is the dimension point, why does one wall not snap right in place to the other one without all these deletions and confusion?


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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 11:46:45 AM | Problems replacing walls....................

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WWHub


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It doesn't matter how the wall is aligned in plan.  What matters is the location line setting of the wall.  That could be Finish face interior / exterior, core face interior / exterior, wall centerline or core centerline.  You probably want to sent them to core exterior if the walls are built correctly.

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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 12:05:16 PM | Problems replacing walls....................

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bauhaus1919


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WWHub is right, just make sure that your new wall is defined by outside face of core and the switch should be as painless as Revit will allow.

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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 1:45:58 PM | Both walls are defined by outside face of core......................

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Hogmodo


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............................yet the walls don't come in aligned in the same way.  Also, having to re-install the windows is disturbing.  When the wall replacement wiped out the windows the first time, I backed up, changed the window family to have the exact same generic wall as the new project wall, replaced the old wall with the new one again and the windows disappeared on me again.

These are stacked walls, both with three walls stacked to make the final wall.  Since stacked walls continue to behave strangely for me in 2008, I wonder it that could be part of the problem.  I even made sure that all of the walls in the stack have the same outside face of core, alignment point.


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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 2:03:32 PM | Problems replacing walls....................

#5

WWHub


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You are probably right about the stack wall problem  In elevation, I would use your split command to split your walls where the wall types should break then use different walls for each portion.

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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 2:10:31 PM | Problems replacing walls....................

#6

bauhaus1919


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I know I've had trouble switching out regular walls for stacked walls in the past, but I've never had to do anything to the extent that you are with stacked-wall-swapping. I wonder if you can unstack like WWHub suggests, switch out each piece for the right piece and "restack" them? I think the "restacking" might be the sticking point in my evil scheme.

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Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 2:46:52 PM | I have a confession, but....................

#7

Hogmodo


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..................................I double checked and the middle wall in one of my 3 wall stacks had the wrong alignment point selection.  I changed it to match the others but still had the same problem.  It sounds like splitting walls in elevation and manually inserting walls at different levels would take more time than just shifting the mis-located walls and re-inserting the windows.

Am I the only Architect in the world that uses a lot of stacked walls?  The nagging problems with wierd stuff happening in stacked walls is frustrating especially when technical support people and experienced Architects like yourselves apparently don't fool with stacked walls much.

My favorite stack wall hissy fit is when I took a four sided rectangle floor plan formed by unjoined stacked walls.  You miter the first corner, no problem, the next, no problem, the third, everything is fine, but then you go and miter the fourth corner and you look and see the first corner, now, unmitered.  Revit tech support's solution was to ask me if any stacked walls were attached to a roof.  Two were and they said to un-attach them, sketch those walls' profiles to the desired wall shapes and the mitering problem went away!?!?!?  They also said if squirelly things start happening with stacked walls, just split them into separate walls on the same side and, most of the time, the squirrelly things go away.


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Wed, Jan 16, 2008 at 11:36:02 AM | Problems replacing walls....................

#8

kesflower


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We're starting to try to use stacked walls more.  Not attaching to the roof is one way to get odd things to resolve, but the problem that really gripes me is when I have a stacked wall, say with differing interior location lines (all aligned to the exterior, of course) and then try to put an interior wall perpendicular to the stacked wall.  It inevitably goes nuts and won't let me join the interior wall to the exterior one.  This is especially problematic on existing projects where its typical for the wall to change width as you go up.

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Ruth Rau

Main Street Architecture, P.C.

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