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Forums >> Revit Structure >> Technical Support >> AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 1:17:42 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#16

seniorcad143


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BigD - sorry I couldn't open your file we are still in Revit 2011.  And we don't have go-to-meeting.

 

I did have the thin mode turned off.  When I cross all the items in plan view and use my filter there are 6 remainging, called Lines (Structural Framing) and they are only at the end of the joist.  I tried taking the very end one and aligning the endpoint to the extended joist end but that did not work when I loaded it into my plan.

 

Is this line I am suppose to be extending, does it go all the way across the joist, because this does not have that.  Let me attach my joist and then maybe you can see what I am talking about.



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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 2:02:22 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#17

BigD


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OK, we're gonna get this fixed.  Smile

Problem is that you're symbolic line is missing completely.  So, let's just create a new one.  Piece-a-cake, but several steps.  I would recommend that you read thru these steps first and then go back and follow them.  Just a suggestion.

  1. Go to OBJECT STYLES, and change the PROJECTION line weight for Structural Framing to 6.  (Don't worry about CUT line weight). (And, 6 is a personal preference.  You can make it fatter or thinner as you like.  This is the line weight your going to see in your plan views)
  2. In Plan View, from the Annotate Tab in the ribbon, select Symbolic Line and make sure that Sub-Category (in the ribbon) is set to Structural Framing [projection].
  3. Now, draw a line anywhere off to the side of the joist, but parallel to the joist, and draw it roughly the same length.  Don't worry about exactly where you draw it as we're going to use the ALIGN command to put exactly in the right spot and lock it.
  4. After you get the Line drawn, you'll probably notice that it's light gray and thin.  Select the line, and from the Properties Pallet, Edit the Visibility Graphics Overrides.  Uncheck every box except Course.  Now you should have a fat, black line.
  5. Now, using the ALIGN command, ALIGN & LOCK each of the END POINTS of your new line to the Reference Planes at either end of your Joist Geometry (I see that you already have your extensions set to 2'-0" so those Reference Planes out at the very end of your Joist Geometry are the ones that control Extensions and the ones you want to align to.)
  6. Now, ALIGN & LOCK your new line to the Reference Plane that represents the Centerline of the joist.
  7. Save, and you're done!

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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 2:47:56 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#18

seniorcad143


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BaHaHaHAHA!!!!!!

 

WE did it!!!  (see below)

 

Thank You!  Thank You!  Thank You! (You are a doll!!!)

 

Now since you know your joist families - can you read the post on joist seat depth posts.  I also want to change the joist family so both seat depths can be different.  I can't seem to get everthing unlocked (Iguess that is it)

 

But anyway thankyou so much!!!

 

 



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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 2:51:50 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#19

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RutRo - I just saw something - my one end that does not have a overhang, the joist does not have a gap to the bearing beam like the other joists does.  I know how this happened - by extending that symbolic line all the way over - but how do I tell it if there is no overhang to stop short of the bearing point?


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 3:02:36 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#20

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Hmmmm (chin scratch)......

The answer to that it a bit more complicated . . . but I'm pretty sure we do it.

Are you familiar with Visibility parameters?  If not, you will be.

Give me a bit to come up with the steps.


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 3:23:46 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#21

seniorcad143


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I think it might have to do with the yes/no parameter.  And then I think there will need to be an "if" in there - for instance "if the end extension is =0" then you use one line and "if end extension >0" then you would use a different line - sometype of parameter with a formula.

 

I guess. - I will work on it also.


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 3:56:21 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#22

seniorcad143


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Actually I am thinking not to use yes/no - just change the formula of the end and start joist extensions to be something like...

=(if(end extension)>0"),not(if(end extesion)=0"-1'-0"))

 

I have to look how to write these formulas.


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 3:59:38 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#23

seniorcad143


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ok maybe this...

=(End Extension>0"),not(End Extension=0")


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 5:24:35 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#24

seniorcad143


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OK i have tried - in the value ...

=if(End Extension>0",End Extension,-1'-0")

 

I tries ading a cutback dim and that value as 1'-0" and then in the End Extension formula...

=if(End Extension>0",End Extension,Cutback)

 

No matter ehat I do it keeps telling me it is circular and it won't let me do it.  I can see how it is circular but as of right now I don't see anyway around it.  I would like to leave the End Extension the way the old one was but I might have to change it.


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 5:35:04 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#25

BigD


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Sorry.  I got really swamped with some shop drawings so it'll be a while before I really dive back into it.

However, I think your idea of using the conditional statement is really good and you're on the right track with that, but those statements usually take me a while to get right.  But it would work.

Another way (a little more cumbersome to use, but easier to create), is to create multiple lines using different line categories, stack them on top of each other and use visibility parameters to drive which lines display and which ones don't.  There are a number of way to go about that.  You could make them instance parameters so that you setup each joist that you place in your project as needed.  Or, you could make them Type parameters so that you control visibility that way (problem is that your TYPE names would need to be unique, and usually the beam tag calls for the Type Name).  Or you could simply use SAVE AS, and create 3 different families: one with NO EXTENSIONS, one with EXTENSIONS AT BOTH ENDS, and one with EXTENSION AT ONE END.

Then, if you could figure out the conditional statement, you could just use one family and have the conditional statement drive the visibility parameters.  Make sense?

Anyway, there's some ideas to chew on.


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 5:44:16 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#26

seniorcad143


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Well - I got the formula to work in the joist family.

 

But when inserted into the project it did not show the joist end offset.  I think I know why, because my symbolic lin is not aligned to the joist cutback line.  But how can it be aligned to two different reference planes.  It is already aligned with the end of the joist reference plane.



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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 6:33:07 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#27

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Yea.  I understand your problem.  That's why I think you'll need multiple lines on top of each other and use visibility parameters to control their visibility.  And of course you'd want to mix your conditional formula in with that.

If you can get all that to work, you'll have something pretty nice



Edited on: Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 12:48:00 PM

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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 6:38:06 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#28

seniorcad143


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Where is my Advil - I have alot more studying to do!


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 6:56:51 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#29

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Dude, you figured out how to get a conditional statement to work!  The rest of it is CAKE in comparison!  It's probably gunna look something like this:

if(Left Extension=0",Sym_Line_with_Extension=no,if(Left Extension=0",Sym_Line_without_Extension=yes,Sym_Line_with_Extension=yes))

And of course, that's only part of it. Smile


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Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 7:27:21 PM | AAARRRGGGHH! Joist questions!

#30

seniorcad143


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OK - My 60 millioin dollar question is how do I get one line to show up for one instance and then use the other line for another instance.  Surely that is not a yes/no parameter is it?  Am I making this harder than it really is?

 

BigD are we the only two out there that is trying to figure this one out, surely someone else has figured this out?


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